|Time is scarce, but many of you have asked
so we wanted
to share some of the 2004 reports that are coming in.
Visitors since 8/25/04
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Tuesday, December 14, 2004 3:21 AM
I purchased a Belgian weanling from a Premarin farm in Canada in November of 2001. The HF Farm he came from was a was one of Fort Dodge's (or Wyeth's) test group for the pregnant mare/WNV reports. He developed chronic laminitis as age 1 1/2 and has rotated three times in the last 14 months on the front left. He is now 3 1/2 (he was an August 11 foal and weaned in October) and has tested positive for Cushings Disease. 6 other people that bought foals from this crop from this farm lost their Belgians between age 1 and 2 due to laminitis. There is no way this could be a coincidence at all. I feel for all the foals and horses that a byproduct of any of Fort Dodge's or Wyeth's tests.
Good luck to everyone and pray for healthy foals.
Wednesday, December 8, 2004 10:20 PM
I run an extremely small breeding operation for the pure love of horses and not to make money. I had read reports of possible problems with the vaccine and was in a quandary as whether or not to vaccinate. I live in Oregon and bred two mares in the spring of 04, one AQHA and one APHA. My vet too assured me that the risk of the disease was far greater than any risk of vaccinating and that there was nothing to be concerned with anyway. I had put it off, but as news of WN arriving in Oregon, I panicked and vaccinated. I was only able to vaccinate one mare as the other jerked in the process, and the vaccine was spilled on the ground. At the time, I was upset about the lost vaccine because they are not cheap. The mare I did vaccinate absorbed her foal and came in heat two weeks later. I will never vaccinate for WN again. My heart goes out to all those who have suffered at the hands of Fort Dodge experiments with our horses.
Troubled in Oregon
Thursday, November 11, 2004 6:56 PM
Hi, My names Sherri and I just recently received a email on this website and found it very informational. We operate a small farm and are very involved with our horses on a daily basis. I'm writing in regards to our 21 yo mare, Dry D Light, a granddaughter of Dry Doc, that has had babies very successfully up until the last 2 years. Shes always been a great producer of very athletic babies. We started vaccinating 3 yrs ago with the fort dodge WN , the last 2 years we have tried to breed and this mare shows to be in at 18 days and then the baby is absorbed by day 45.We know its not the stallion as the girl who owns him doesnt vacc with WN and had 12 successful babies this year. Out of the 12 mares only 3 were vacc that belonged to other clients, One of which carried to nearly 13 months. 2 years in a row this has happened with the breeding and the vet hasn't been able to explain whats going on. He says theres no reason for her not to stay preg. I now believe after reading some of these reports that this might be happening to her. I'm not sure where to go with this as we also want to protect her but still would love to conceive a baby from her as well. We own a small farm with 18 horses with 14 of them being mares, working and brood, 3 geldings and 1 stud. So how do we know what to do? I do know this year we wont be vacc her with the WNV hoping we havent ruined our last chance with this mare. We love each and everyone of our horses and always try to do the best for them including all vaccs wormings coggins shoeing and supplements. I would hate to know that by vaccinating I may have caused her harm I'm curious as to what the USDA is doing about the problem. I don't want to point fingers as we don't know for sure what's going on with her other than now, she cant seem to carry a foal after the WNV was administrated Any input is greatly appreciated Thanks in advance
sherri walls Boaz Al W&W Farms
Thursday, September 23, 2004 12:39 PM
IT IS PURE LUCK THAT I RAN ACROSS THIS WEB SITE YESTERDAY. I HAVE A 6 YR OLD QUARTER HORSE WHO WAS THE MOST SWEETEST HORSE YOU HAVE EVER SEEN. SHE LOVED TO HAVE HUGS, KISSES, AND JUST WANTED TO BE TOUCHED AT ALL TIMES. MY 6 YR OLD AND 11 YR OLD KIDS WOULD TAKE HER AND LEAD HER AROUND AND WORK WITH HER AND SHE JUST LOVED IT. ABOUT A MONTH I HAD MY VET COME OUT TO GIVER HER ALL OF HER SHOTS INCLUDING WEST NILE VIRUS. I HAVE NEVER HEARD ANYTHING ABOUT THE WNV SHOT HAVING ANY SIDE EFFECTS UNTIL I SEEN THIS WEBSITE YESTERDAY. I STARTED NOTICING SHE WAS GETTING UPSET ALOT AND THAT WAS OUT OF HER NORMAL BEHAVIOR. FOR THE PAST WEEK SHE IS GETTING MORE AND MORE AGGRESSIVE TOWARDS PEOPLE AND OTHER HORSES. SHE HAS TRIED TO KICK ME SEVERAL TIMES, TRIES TO BITE ME EVERY TIME SHE HAS A CHANCE AND SHE HAS LUNGED AT ME AND MY KIDS. THIS IS NOT HER NORMAL BEHAVIOR. I HAVE NEVER BEEN SCARED OF HER NOT EVEN THE FIRST DAY WE GOT HER. SHE HAS ALWAYS BEEN A VERY SWEET, LOVING, GENTLE HORSE AND THAT IS NOT THE CASE NOW. SHE HAS A BAD TEMPER NOW AND EVERY TIME SHE SEES ME SHE THROWS HER EARS BACK AND TRIES TO DO SOMETHING TO ME. IT IS VERY HEART BREAKING TO SEE HER THIS WAY. I RECENTLY GOT A PREGNANT QUARTER HORSE AND HER 4 MONTH OLD FOAL. I THOUGHT THAT MIGHT HAVE HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH IT UNTIL I SEEN THIS WEBSITE. SHE HAS ALWAYS BEEN AROUND OTHER HORSES ALL OF HER LIFE. SHE WAS WITH A 30 YR OLD HORSE UP UNTIL WE GOT THE PREGNANT MARE AND HER FOAL. THERE WAS NEVER A PROBLEM WITH HER AND OTHER HORSES OR HUMANS UNTIL SHE RECEIVED HER WNV SHOT AND THEN EVERYTHING WENT DOWN HILL FROM THERE. MY VET IS COMING OUT TODAY HE WAS SUPPOSED TO GIVER HER THE BOOSTER FOR WNV AND GIVE THE PREGNANT MARE AND FOAL THEIR SHOTS. NEEDLESS TO SAY THAT WILL NOT BE HAPPENING NOW!!!!!!!!!!!! LIKE I SAID IT WAS PURE LUCK THAT I RAN ACROSS THIS WEBSITE YESTERDAY BECAUSE IF I HAD NOT THEN THEY WOULD ALL BE GETTING THEIR SHOTS TODAY. I CAN NOT THANK EVERYONE ENOUGH FOR PUTTING THEIR STORIES ON HERE FOR ALL OF US TO READ. EVERYONE THINKS THAT I AM CRAZY FOR THINKING ITS THE WNV SHOT THAT HAS DONE THIS BUT I AM THE ONLY ONE HE TRULY KNOWS MY HORSE AND I KNOW SOMETHING IS NOT RIGHT. I THINK WE ALL NEED TO TAKE A STAND AND FIGHT THIS THING TOGETHER IT IS HORRIBLE THAT THIS IS GOING ON AND HEARTBREAKING THAT ALL OF THESE FOALS AND HORSES AND DYING AND NO ONE IS WILLING TO STAND UP AND TAKE THE BLAME FOR THIS. THEY ALL WANT TO SWEEP IT UNDER THE RUG AND THAT IS NOT FAIR TO ANY OF THIS. ALL WE WANTED TO DO IS PROTECT OUR HORSES (OUR CHILDREN) AND LOOK AND WHAT WE GOT IN THE END. I THINK IF ANY OF THE VETS KNOW OF THIS AND THEY DO NOT TELL THE OWNERS ABOUT IT BEFORE THEY GIVE THE SHOT THEY NEED TO BE PUT OUT OF BUSINESS. PLEASE E-MAIL ME AT JAAAB@BELLSOUTH.NET IF YOU HAVE ANY STORIES LIKE MINE. I KNOW I'M NOT CRAZY LIKE EVERYBODY THINKS. I APPRECIATE EVERYONE'S STORY AND MY HEART GOES OUT TO ALL OF YOU.
ANGELA FROM BRIGHTON, TENNESSEE
Wednesday, September 15, 2004 3:26 PM
I have been in the breeding business for
many years, and had never had any type of
problems beforehand. After listening to
my Vet's recommendations, I paid the price
and gave my mares the West Nile Vaccine.
Within 7 days my mares began aborting near
full term foals ~ Blood tests were conducted
and titers came back for West Nile, and Rhino,
but of course they would!!! I just gave the shots!
Not one Vet could answer conclusively.
This year 2004 I have a herd of fat and healthy
mares, that will not breed back. They do come
into a strong heat cycle, but will not become
pregnant or settle with foal. WHY?
This is my "business" and this is how I make my living
and I must tell you, it hurts feeding a whole herd
with drought, hay & grain prices on a weekly basis
these horses on my farm enjoy every creature comfort,
and not have a single one of them producing for you.
I have never in my life had a single problem before
giving west nile shots. And I will NOT ever give
them again, Fort Dodge has made Billions off this
as I've lost thousands upon thousands of dollars in
my breeding business, and yes, this truly upsets me.
My question would be, who is to be held responsible?
Tuesday, September 7, 2004 12:18 AM
On the advice oof my vet I vaccinated my Arabian mares with WNV. The first vaccination seemed innocuous enough, but when the 2nd one was given in a month one mare became very ill and was hospitalized for 4 days. This was a little over a year ago. Since that time she would not eat her hay and on occasion would collapse. The vets always diagnosed colic, but her condition worsened. Her coat became dull and she refused to eat hay, however she did eat grass and grain. When she collapsed, if she was conscious, she would raise her head and try to eat grass under her head. This summer she received another WNV from the vet and after that her condition deteriorated rapidly. She died July 3, 2004. Her daughter also received the same vaccination, at the same time. She has started losing weight and now will not eat hay, but will eat grain and green grass. She has lost weight and seems depressed. Is there any research that would indicate a change in intestinal mucosa, causing a horse to refuse hay. We grow the hay on the farm and they have eated it for 13 years until now. Anita M
Wednesday, August 11, 2004
My God I thought I was the only one till a friend sent me to this site.
I had the vet out (a new one) who gave my horses and ponies a list of VAX. half I had never heard of, she said they were all necessary. My main vet was on vacation, I should have waited. The next morning I had three horses down and the rest with fevers. My pony mare aborted,two months from foal date, another mare had such a sever case of the runs we thought we would lose her. My 3yr old TB baby was rushed to the vet school. He died a week later. They said they didn't know what was wrong with him. But something had eaten away his urethra. They disagreed it was the shots,but all these animals were healthy before the shots. The west Nile VAX. does cause mares to abort,and if a horse is bitten by a west Nile carrier they are still getting it anyway. So it's a no brainer to give them the shots. . I haven't had shots for anyone this season and don't intend to. They are still sending cards telling me that the poisons are due. I think they know what they are doing, they make the animal sick then you spend thousands and thousand... for them to make it better Unless they kill it in the process. Vets just aren't what they used to be. And my 3yr old TB had only just started his ground work,I never got to ride him.
I'll never have another vet give another horse of mine anything!!!
Cindy F. Elf Acres
Wednesday, August 18, 2004
My four month old beautiful colt, Dakota, was given a wn innoculant and within 48 hours he was showing all the symptoms of west nile.
We tried to save him and could have if we had been able to get a fluid iv in him. the vet was not interested and said he had more than likely coliced.
I used everything I knew to use and on the 4th day if I could have gotten fluids in him there was still hope. It was awful He had previously been the picture of great health and was sold. The potential owners, transporters and insurance companies insisted he have a west nile shot.
this is the 4th animal out of a herd of 30 that has died following innocculation with fort dodge. The fist year I did not give shots and started in 2003.
I lost 3 foals and believe it to be related from the shots.
I also lost an adult mare the same way within 14 days of giving the shots she had all the symptoms. 2 others survived, one was wobbling and drooling and the other as well went temporarly blind.
all my broodmares appear who have all been great producers seem not to be able to get in foal. I innocculated my studs as well and notice a behavior change in one.
The vet said it was not the shots.
We desperately need more vets inthe el Dorado springs, Mo. area theres soo many opportunities for a real vet here not just a sales barn vet.
thanks for listeningKaren
Wednesday, August 11, 2004
My name is John O., and I live in Pennsylvania. I am a pony breeder, mostly classic shetlands and grades...driving is my hobby. Of three births, this year, I had one live birth. The other two were born dead. Fully formed, but came out with the afterbirth with the foal, which used to be called sluffing off a dead fetus.
Of interest is this, and I hope someone will take note of it. My one mare had NO west nile, Fort Dodge strain shot...as she was carrying a near term baby. I decided to wait until after foaling. The foal was born without any problems. It is thriving at 3 months. The other two mares were given the west nile shot, by itself, not in conjunction with other vaccines, but as a single, separate dose. They were given the shots approximately 3 months prior to delivery date. Both mares droped fully formed, dead foals. I have another mare still due and will report it and I hope and pray this one makes it. Something has to be wrong here. I am a good herdsman, the animals are stall kept, cleaned twice a day and are in exellent condition and health and receive the best of care.
It just cannot be conincidence that the two mares WITH the shot lost foals. The one without it had a live one. Although inconclusive, it certainly points to a problem with vaccinating pregnant mares with West Nile Vaccine and I firmly believe that testing and the appropriate studies were not made in an attempt to market a product post haste. That is how I feel about it. I would have been far better of without getting any of the West Nile Shots at all..and I will not get them again. Thank you.
Friday, July 2, 2004
I am a small occassional breeder. I bought 2 mares and vaccianted both for the West Nile. These were to be my first babies in almost a decade. My mares both carried to full term. The first foal had a jaw longer than the top, her front legs were deformed and would have required splinting. The biggest problem for her though was her was the huge lump in her throat that the vets could not explain. Blood tests came back with hormone levels five times higher than what is normal in a horse. This was a 3 day old foal. Even Guelph university that does research ect couldn't tell us what we were looking at. SO I had her euthanized rather than watch her slowly break down.
My other foal was born and her tendons contracted so badly she could not stand. It is a month later and the conclusion of this story is still untold. I fed and looked after my mares like they were my own children, they wanted for nothing. If it was the vaccine or chance I don't know but ai am hearing some things from other breeders in the province about defects along with this vaccine.
We also had a horse at our barn last year receive all of her vaccines, including the West nile at once. SHe reacted to it and ended up banger her head until it killed her. I don't have to tell you what that looked like.
Michelle H., Thedford, On Canada
Thursday, June 24, 2004
I had a filly born yesterday that was horribly disfigured. Her hind legs bent upwards towards her hock at a right angle. Her neck was either too short or twisted so that her head lay on her neck. Unfortunately, she was born alive. Her brain function seemed normal and she definitely wanted to get up. I had never seen anything like that in my life. As I put her down, I kept thinking that there had to be a reason for this. I found your website on the internet and was intrigued by the WNV vaccine theory. To me, it makes sense. I have faithfully vaccinated all my horses every year since 2002. I have had a huge decrease in mares becoming pregnant. I thought our stallion was at fault, but he hadnt had any problems in the past. Also, this mare that foaled yesterday had a very healthy baby in 2001 (prior to WNV). I havent vaccinated yet this year and I dont think that I will after reading all of your good information. I took pictures of the baby before I buried it, but not with a digital camera or I would forward them to you. It seems that the vaccination came on the market very quickly and I am sure that animal vaccinations do not go through the same rigorous testing that human vaccinations do. I am sick about this as I think this tragedy and others could have been prevented. Fortunately, my mare lived. I am not sure how she did it as the baby was so disfigured that its head and neck were about twice as big as a normal foal. Thank you for your information.
Beth O. Broadview, Montana
Tuesday, June 15, 2004
A good friend of mine had a mare named Nevada O'leana, a direct granddaughter of Doc O'leana, that she used for cutting. The mare is seven years old and has amazing training. She had two very healthy live foals that are going on the cutting circuit. She was give the WNV after she was bred. Her third colt was three weeks late. At first all looked good. After about a day and a half went by they noticed he wasn't feeding and had trouble standing on his now soft front legs. They had several vets come out and none knew what was wrong. After 10 sad days of getting better and getting worse he died. I believe this was a birth defect caused by the WNV and so do the vets now that all is coming unraveled.
Emily Owner/Trainer Equine Enterprises, Tucson, Arizona
Tuesday, June 15, 2004
I am a recent re-subscriber to Equus magazine so you may have already covered my concern in a previous issue that I did not receive.
If you have not already done so, I think you need to start warning horse owners of the potential risks to pregnant mares of the Fort Dodge West Niles Virus Innovator vaccine. I have already talked to Dr. Moses of Fort Dodge to register my complaints about the adverse injection reaction one of my mares had to it. I vaccinated 20 horses, all geldings except one mare (not pregnant) and only my mare had a negative reaction. (That was seven weeks ago and she's still messed up with no plausible explanation from my Vet.) I then started talking to breeders in my community who have said that they are having more rebreeds with their stallions than ever before, plus they are losing foals this year. Their mares are delivering stillborn babies and they feel sure there is a connection to the WNV vaccine. None of us started vaccinating for WNV until the past year or two.
I have two other mares who are due to foal in May so I decided to call Fort Dodge before I risked vaccinating them. I spoke with Dr. Moses to ask her if it was safe to vaccinate my mares. She said that pregnant mares are an off label use of the product. In other words, no where on the bottle does it say that their WNV vaccine is 'safe for pregnant mares'. But neither does it say that it is unsafe. I think the vaccine is so new that inadequate research has been done on it with pregnant mares. When breeders start connecting their loss of babies to the only thing different in their programs, the WNV injections, I think they will make a connection between the two. My friends who have brood mares and stallions are witnessing their mares not settling as soon as usual, or they have a higher percentage of mares absorbing, aborting, or delivering stillborn babies. One of my friends has lost 6 babies, worth $50,000 each, and another has lost 11 which is 33% of his yearly crop of foals.
Dr. Moses told me the WNV vaccine would be safe for my two pregnant mares and that they had vaccinated thousands of mares without incidence. Why would I take the chance this close to delivery based on my friends' suspicions about the vaccine? No way. I'm just glad I became suspicious before I risked losing two foals. I'm surely not the only person who has made this connection. Fort Dodge has to be getting numerous complaints. This is too prevalent to be coincidental.
I think it would be nice if you would warn your readers about the possible pitfalls of this product. Is research really being done on pregnant mares? How long will it take to get test results? Where are the studies being done? How many mares in the test program? Talk to some vets and tell your readers of the problem and let them decide whether to chance it or not. Some of my area vets aren't even aware that there is a problem nor was the State Vet with the Oklahoma Dept. of Agriculture until I started calling her with my suspicions. You could tell she was ignoring everything I had to say. Somebody needs to pay attention to our concerns. Amelie
- Worried Horse Owner in Oklahoma -
Friday, May 14, 2004
Have you read this letter from the USDA to Fort Dodge about company policies?
Connie & Amy W. Molalla, OR
Tuesday, May 11, 2004
I used West Niles last spring on my mares. This April 1, My only mare in foal had he colt and he died in 3 days, she carried for 12 months, unlike the foal she had before with the normal due date. I also vaccinated some minis with West Niles and one mare died a couple of months ago, This seams to coincidental to me. I have never lost any foals or have had any sick horse before I used West Niles. I think there is a problem here !!!!!!!!!!!! No only is my heart wrenched over the lose of my colt with Champion Blood lines and the vet bills to find out what was wrong with my horses and the Vet could not tell me what the problem was. I ask the vet. what other animals were getting the West Niles and he said none were. I guess we are guinea pigs. for Fort Dodge. I am not a happy camper
Wednesday, May 5, 2004
I have a very healthy 7 year old mare that I bred last spring. After 2 covers she was ultra sounded and confirmed in foal. Imagine my surprise this spring when she came into heat. While I know that mares do lose foals, abort them, re absorb them and the like. I know that this mare was healthily in foal in the late fall. She received her first of two west nile vaccines in late september and the second three weeks later. She had the best food and care all during her pregnancy, and the recommended shots at 5, 7 & 9 months. When I took her back to be re bred I was asked if she had received a west nile shot during her pregnancy. I would not have given her the vaccine had I known there was any risk to my foal. While I can not prove the vaccine was the cause, I will NOT be vaccinating her again.
Sunday, May 2, 2004
We ignorantly listened to our vet's advice and had him vaccinate our 2 Peruvian Paso geldings with the West Nile Virus genetically modified live virus vaccine in Feb. of 2003 with a booster four weeks later. On Feb. 9, 2004 we had the vet return to give the WNV vaccination. Our nearly six year old gelding began barely favoring his rear left leg soon after. We are in Canada and the manufacturer is Wyeth Animal Health and I phoned their 1 (800) 267-1777 number. They would give me no information. (I will also venture to guess they will state they have not had a reported case from an owner on Feb. 27, 2004, even though I gave them my name and begged for help with the reaction in our gelding.) This gelding has now undergone two and half months of medications (with almost two dozen needles as well as oral drugs), drains oozing for over two months, and masses of time and money lovingly doled out in our heartbreaking attempt to undo the wrong caused this horse. I am terrified to think of the repercussions not just for our wonderful horse, but for the entire industry that has been hit with infertility and death in our most conscientious breeding facilities and most valued stock. I am sickened.
Wendy in BC
Wednesday, April 21, 2004
I vaccinated my horses on April second, on month later my foundationbred mare began to drip from her vagina, she red-bagged and we lost a very valuable foal that night. Another mare foaled at term, but her filly had bad front legs, very knock kneed, we had to put screws into her legs which cost us $2500 and a lot of trauma for the filly. she will only be able to be a trail horse, no jumping or reining or anything. We had another healthy mare that it took 3 months to get in foal. We will NOT vaccinate our mares while breeding or in foal.
Liz J, Colorado
Tuesday, April 20, 2004
I am a APHA breeder in wisconsin I have been a breeder for 9 years and never had anything like this.The first dose I gave to my stud 4 days later he was off feed and very weak The vet came out and did blood tests and checked his temp and could not find out what could have caused this, now as time goes on I put the pieces together and feel I almost lost him do to a reaction from the west nile shot. I have 35 APHA mares and 3 APHA stallions. I gave 4 mares the west nile shots and all my stallions the shot. My first 8 mares are all in foal and are due soon, after the 2 dose of west nile shots where given to my studs I have 27 open mares now. This is very disapointing and I find out now that the shot was never tested for the fertilization of breeding stallions. The mares where all esposed and showed heat cycles and know that I had them all bred.Help !!Tammy, Classy Piants. Wisconsin
Tuesday, April 6, 2004
We breed miniature horses, and after our experience in the last two weeks, we are also questioning the WNV vaccine. The following story is one that we posted on a chat group:
We just lost two foals, one from Flash, and one from Lady. Both mares were bred to 2 different stallions, and both foals were early. Flash's foal was about 7-8 weeks early, and Lady's foal was about 3-4 weeks early. Both foals had extreme deformaties, and I am sweating Panchita, who is next to foal. We did some tracing back as to causes, and the only thing we came up with was WNV vaccine. Flash's foal was a colt who was a sabino visually, and could have been positive for frame. Lady's foal was a frame filly. We vacinated all the horses last year, and followed Ft. Dodge's instructions and we did not vaccinate the mares within the first 90 days of conception. It doesn't matter when you vaccinate the mares as you run the risk of getting deformed foals. Also a couple of the mares had a very hard time getting settled and they were in with the stallions 24/7 for an entire year. I will never vaccinate my horses with WNV vaccine ever again. And we are sweating bullets waiting for the last 4 mares to deliver. I wish there was some way to prove that this vaccine, in my opinion is DEADLY!!!!!!!!!!!!
We have ruled out feed, did not change that, and had 2 healthy foals last year. The foals that just died were not genetically deformed, only injections could do to these babies what this vaccine did to them. We are getting over the loss of our two foals, and I do blame WNV vaccine for the loss of them. But I am not telling anyone not to use it, as I used it last year and was very comfortable with it. But when I gave the vaccine to the yearlings and the babies and the stallions, it was fine with me also. I felt as a lot of people did, that the vaccine was fine. I also listened to the horror stories that was put out there and I didn't believe it either, until it happened to us. We did hold off and not give it to the pregnant mares 2 year ago, because they were so close to delivering.
But I, myself will never use WNV vaccine ever again. My horses are healthy and have an excellent diet, as they are in pastures plus they get bermuda and alfalfa mixed hay every day, and the hay is grown right here on the valley floor, so no fescue. The pastures have had horses in them for the last 5 years, with no ill effects and have delivered healthy foals, so it is not the food. There is no introduction of any other horses over the last 2 years, so that is not the culprit. There is nothing new with the farms on each side of us, as they are all the same, so that couldn't have been it. No one is behind us, so that is not the problem. So, no new neighbors, no new feed, no new anything, and the only vaccine we gave differently and for the first time last year, was the WNV vaccine. We give our horses the normal EWFT, and Rhino/Flu, and we order that from Jeffers.
The only thing that comes to mind is the "Thalidomide drug", and for those of you that aren't old enough to remember this tragedy, let me tell you about it. Back in the early 60's the drug was deemed safe as a sedative, well the side effect was it also stopped pregnant women from throwing up. Everyone thought this was terrific until all the babies were born without limbs and very deformed. They traced it back to the women taking thalidomide because they were throwing up. It was pulled from the shelves and from what I understand is never to be distributed in the U.S again.
From my understanding, this is a variation of a vaccine that Ft. Dodge already had, but added a few more ingredients to it. Until someone can prove to me that it was not the vaccine, I will continue to blame the WNV vaccine, because that is the "only" and I do mean only thing different that we have done, or has happened to these horses. As I said these were not dwarves, these babies were so horribly deformed with twisted legs, giraffe heads, and etc. If these were dwarves, then how come the same deformed foals have been born to other people who also gave the WNV vaccine. Our foals are identical to the ones they lost. These foals were also fully developed at 290 days and at 305 days, and according to several vets we have asked, the hair is the last to develop and these foals had hair on them when they were born which was 4-7 weeks early. You may think that we were mistaken on the date they were pregnant, but we had a vet ultrasound the mares at 19 and 20 days of conception and said yes they were pregnant at that early stage, so we are not wrong on the conception dates. A foal is not supposed to have hair on them at 290 days in utero, and at 305 days in utero.
We noticed another thing that was different about the mares that had the deformed foals: They bagged up and delivered within a week!!!!! I mean they went from no bag to a full bag in about 2 days, not slowly over time which is normal. I know that they are times when mares do that, but it is not common. And from talking to other horse breeders, for that to happen to our two mares is like getting struck by lightening twice in one day in the same place. Well both of these mares did it. We even had the vet out Saturday on Lady (last mare) and the vet told us she was about 2 to 3 weeks before delivering, she bagged up and delivered by the following Thurs. night.
In conclusion, as I said until someone can prove to me that it was some other extraneous thing that happened to both of these mares, I will blame the vaccine, because that is the only thing that was different. We are waiting on the remaining 4 mares, hoping that we don't have the same problems with them, and hoping they deliver healthy foals.
Tuesday, April 6, 2004
My 6 year old TB mare was rushed to LSUs large animal clinic for an emergency C-section on
This mare is in the peak of health *routinely wormed and vaccinated, she has not even had a runny nose or any incident in the two years I have owned her. Last year she delivered a beautiful foal and today this yearling is thriving. She was in foal to the same stallion, bred A I, all the same feeds and hay and pasture as before. The only thing different was the fact the she was inoculated for
I am not one to point the finger at anyone *I think that more good data and research needs to be done. I was in touch with my Vet yesterday and he is going to contact
Monday, April 5, 2004
We own a small broodmare band, and two stallions. One of these mares is a 10 year old palomino breeding stock American Paint mare, and we've owned her for the past 7 years. She has provided us with 3 healthy offspring, all of which were delivered without serious complication. We are very involved in the pregnancy and delivery of our broodmares, and know their cycles, foaling patterns, and personalities very well.
This particular mare foals like clockwork. She never delivered a baby more than one day beyond her due date, for us, or her previous owner. So, when she was 10 days late this year, we began to become concerned.
That night, we went out to our barn to check her at around 10:15 pm. She was showing no signs of labor, so we returned to our house to wait. At midnight, we again went out to the barn, only to find a stillborn colt, with no apparent cause of death. There was more blood in the stall than usual, but the mare was not actively hemorrhaging. It did take her much longer than usual to pass her placenta.
This mare was vaccinated against WNV early in her pregnancy, and boostered mid-pregnancy. We had one other mare besides this one foal, and the tendons in the colts legs are a bit tighter than normal. We have one more mare due at the end of May. Coincidence? I don't know. All I can say is that I will not be revaccinating until the FDA addresses my concerns.
~ J., New Ringgold, PA.
Saturday, April 3, 2004
I myself lost a foal in 2003 for no apparent reason just chalking it up to bad luck but after reading these reports and looking back through breeding and vaccination reports I am starting to really wonder. Our mare had her first wnv vaccination 10 days before she was bred ai and had her second booster 19 days later so she was bred in between the 2 shots. She aborted her foal at 8 months with no conclusive reason. Our 3 other mares where bred and vaccinated on the same dates but did not catch, the other mares have always caught the first time and delivered healthy foals.
Robert H. Ontario, Canada
Friday, April 2, 2004
To others who have had this tragedy. I weighted so long for this foal and we were so close to my mares due date my vet said along with my pre foaling shots that I needed to give WNV so on 3/24/04 all 3 of my pregnant mares were vaccinated one of my mares was due on April 16, 2004 the next one is due on May 6,2004 & the last due on May 16,2004. So fare the first mare has lost her baby I believed my vet when he said it was safe others told me not to vaccinate for WNV know I am afraid that I am going to lose my other baby's or they are going to be born sick or disfigured Today is April 2, 2004 I took my foal first to my vet who looked it over and then told me to take it to a lab to be tested I told my vet and the lab my fear they both said that WNV was safe that they think the foal was born dead & that they think it has some kind of infection I don't know what to believe hopefully the test will tell and my other mares will have healthy baby's how ever I don't know if I will ever vaccinate my mares for WN again.
Dawn Riverside County
Friday, April 2, 2004
My name is Leslie and I live in South Texas. I live near the coast so we are always wet and West Nile is a threat. I only have four horses and I was keeping them vaccinated until now. Last May I had my mare bred. 30 days into her pregnancy she was vaccinated ( booster) for WN. In September she was still confirmed in foal. However, in December I started to realize that she did not look to be in foal. This was her first baby and she is a very long and lean horse so I figured she was one of those that would get big during the last few months. By February I had her checked and there was no baby. A prominent breeder in the area also says it is the West Nile vaccine. She has had lost babies, deformed babies and mares that are very late. I am breeding my mare back now. She had her WN vaccination in February and we have decided to take our chances and not revaccinate her and hope for a healthy baby next year.
I hope your web site will keep us informed of any new developments with this vaccine.
Wednesday, March 31, 2004
I saw your site and just wanted to let everyone know what was going on at my ranch. We have been raising Miniature Horses for about 20 years or so now without any foaling problems (maybe one every other year) but they were all natural problems like babies getting turned around and things like that. When the WNV started occurring we knew that we were going to need to vaccinate as soon as possible because of our mosquito problem. So we had it done (cost us about $3000 to vaccinate our 50 horses once we were through for the year). This included our top stallions (most in prime one about 18 yrs. old) bred mares and foals. 3 of our upcoming yearlings died during the winter for no reason. We were expecting about 25 healthy foals for the season. All were vet checked in foal and by proven healthy stallions. I got 8 foals that year and only 5 live to this day. I had 2 deformed foals born about 1 month early with the same symptoms (no pedigree simalarities!). They had large tongues, HUGE heads which severly clogged up our 28" mares, and their front and back legs were switched around. When they first started coming out we thought they were just coming butt first and that was the problem...not even close! That same year when the breeding season arrived we noticed that maybe 5 of our 32 mares had showed any signs of heat during that first month (May...it's chilly up here in april!) and not ONE of them took. Not only were our mares cycles messed up but our stallions semen count was down so far we thought we were going to have to breed all of our mares to outside stallions. This was bad since we have 9 stallions! 14 mares vet checked in foal and the next year we got 5 foals. I've NEVER had a foal crop so low with so many mares and healthy young stallions even when I first started out with one stallion and 20 2 year old mares! Once again I had 2 deformed foals (both unrelated to each other and the other two I had before) and all of the other mares either absorbed or aborted. During the winter one of my best broodmares was found dead out in the pasture (note she was still nursing her healthy filly) and was in foal for the next year. She was a taller mare (33") and had NEVER had any other problems with her foals. At 8 years old she still had a good 10 years left in her.
It never got through my head that it might be the WNV Vaccinations until I read your website. How stupid could I be?? My mares and stallions were vaccinated last fall and I regret it. I will NOT vaccinate any of my horses this year. I will see how it goes and see how my stallions respond without the shots. If I find that the WNV Vax has any remote possibility of being the problem then never again will another horse of mine have a vet or anyone put that vaccination into them. Not after how much love I lost and how much sadness was brought with my losses.
This year that $3000 vaccination money will be put into a HUGE supply of fly spray!
O Henrys Minitails SE North Dakota.
Tuesday, March 30, 2004
Last year I began hearing reports of abortions and deformities, and mares not making bag, all from being vaccinated during pregnancy. I am a small breeder of performance Quarter Horses, and decided to hold of on vaccinations until delivery, then vaccinated before breeding the mares back. Everything went fine. This year I only had one mare in foal due to deliver April15, 2004. On March 22, 2004 I had her vaccinated for her last pneumabort and three-way, and my vet convinced me to administer the West Nile so the baby would have the antibodies. The following Sunday, my mare delivered a beautiful, fully formed and big grulla colt, who was premature. We fought hard, as he did, to help him survive, but had to put him down this morning. This mare has had four other babies that I know of, with no problems. I am fully convinced that this premature delivery was due to the vaccine.
I have a friend in New Mexico, that two years ago, had six pregnant mares that were vaccinated with the WNV during the first trimester, and all of them aborted. Her vet has poo-pooed the accusation against WNV, as does my vet. An interesting side note..there was another foal born in critical condition shortly after mine, and the problem was the mare never came into her milk. I have heard of other breeders whose mares are not bagging up. There needs to be a study, and warnings so that respected veterinarians don't encourage WNV during pregnancy. I, for one, will never vaccinate a pregnant mare again. I will do it before breeding, or after foaling. This has been a heartbreaking experience for me, and I am carrying the guilt for losing this wonderful little guy, because of not sticking to my guns.
Gail T, Paonia, CO
Sunday, March 28, 2004
I am a pre-veterinary student doing research on the equine West Nile virus. I happened upon your site and just have to share my story. I maintain a small group of broodmares and utilize shipped semen. I bred the three mares in May with shipped semen. While the vet was at the farm I went ahead and had him vaccinate for the year. He suggested the WNV vaccine and I had him do it. All three mares were checked by ultrasound in foal at 30 days. I had them checked again at 50 days and they were all still pregnant. At the palpation on day 80 two of the mares had absorbed. I was devastated and did not even tie in the vaccine. In previous years, one of the mares had stuck on first shipment and delivered a healthy foal. The other mare has had 12 foals with no slips in her broodmare career. I am now completely concerned about the state of the foal the other mare is carrying after seeing your pictures. I will watch her closely; she is due in 10 days.
Nathaniel N, Kentucky
Saturday, March 27, 2004
Hello Lost Foals Group,
Keep up the good work, I am not a breeder and I am a RVT and I chose not to vaccinate my horses against WNV mostly because I did not trust the vaccine. I know of people who are having problems with stallions who were fertile (they have foals on the ground) but after vacc. they have little or no live sperm!
The reason I am writing you is because My friend asked me for this site so I tried to e-mail it to her and it kept getting kicked back to me as undeliverable. Well it seems that AOL has chosen to trample our First Amendment rights and they are not letting people send your URL to its members. They say they have had a high number of complaints about the URL. Yea right! Probably all from Fort Dodge! This is just a heads up that if someone wants to send your URL to an AOL member, they need to drop the first part and just send the main part of the address.
Linda in California
Thursday, March 25, 2004
I have no proof of that the WNV caused my horses death but he was injected
at 1PM in the afternoon and dead by morning. He was in excellent health
although old (28).
The circumstances of his death are very suspicious. Please warn other
owners of old horse not to vacinate against WNV.
Friday, March 26, 2004
My story.......I have one broodmare. We have always used cooled shipped semen for breeding and AI on this mare. She has successfully been bred each time, and ultra sounded "in foal", always had a good pregnancy, always had easy quick births, nice healthy foals. In 2003 we did the same type of breeding, had her ultra sounded "in foal". Three months later we gave her the WNV. She came into heat within days. I let it go....thinking sometimes mares act in heat when they've been pronounced "in foal". Well, again she came into heat. I called the vet out.........we palpated her at supposedly 4 months into the pregnancy..........NO FOAL! I really believe it was due to the vaccine. I opted not to breed this year since we have such a flooding of horses on the market this year, but if I had bred her........you can bet she wouldn't be receiving the WNV
I live in Oregon and wish my name to be withheld. I wish my email not to be distributed either. Thank you. C.M.
Thursday, March 25, 2004
Just today, March 25, 2004, I received an email with a link to this website. I had been looking for confirmation that maybe I was right in my assessment that the WN vaccine is unsafe, at least for pregnant or breeding mares. In early August 2002, the local television station came out to interview me about WN vaccine. My response was that I was uncomfortable using it and especially uneasy about the safety issue in pregnant mares. However, they also interviewed several vets that aired in the same report who stated that it was SAFE and made me look like an idiot. To make a long story short, I was shamed into vaccinating all of my horses, including two pregnant mares, and boostering three weeks later and again in the spring of 2003.
In May and June 2003, both mares foaled. The one in May was overdue and the foal's legs went in every direction. (Note: both sire and dam are straight legged and are proven producers). This was a high dollar foal and we have spent a considerable amount trying to get him straight.
The early foal in June had contracted tendons and the mare retained her placenta. The foal had diarrhea for three months despite extensive testing and they still couldn't find out what was wrong.
I pride myself on breeding beautiful, straight legged foals and I have never had a year when legs went every direction!!
In 2003, my niece, a friend and I bred several mares to national champion stallions. Two of the three mares didn't take despite repeated breeding, ultrasounds, etc. The third mare was confirmed in foal via two ultrasounds, but lost her foal somewhere between 60 and 90 days.
I also have Minis. The one mare that I managed to get in foal aborted at five months along. We do NOT have any mares in foal for 2004.
I have also talked to several friends and the story is the same: mares that were vaccinated either couldn't get in foal or aborted. The ones who did not vaccinate, settled all of their mares and had healthy foals last year.
I have repeatedly asked every vet that I meet about the WN vaccine and they say,"Fort Dodge says it's safe!" On March 23, at a meeting about WN vaccine a Fort Dodge rep (also a vet) says it is safe although they have now added a line that says "Not tested in pregnant mares." He also talked about all the RUMORS on the internet about the vaccine!!
My vet at [the same meeting] also said that he had been told by equine reproductionists that mares shouldn't be vaccinated until at least 45 days in foal.
Guess what folks, I WILL NOT be vaccinating with WN vaccine this year.
I am a free lance writer and would love to write an article, but I wonder which magazine would publish it!! Fort Dodge's advertising power is greater than free, informative editorial.
Faye R., Austin, MN
Thursday, March 25, 2004
I read the info on your site. So.. ok! Now what do we do. Here I am trying to provide the absolute best care for my beloved horses and I might be making them sterile!!! Help! My Vet was just here yesterday and gave them all of their shots. I trust my vet with the care of my horses. How is it possible that an experimental drug that has only been in use for one year and has already shown so many side effects is still being used??? My friend lost a foal last year and thought it might be the shot that did it. How can we be knowledgeable if the information just is not out there or is so misleading. I am not a farrier so I do not put shoes on my horses, I am also not a vet so I do not think I should keep up on every possible problem. (Even though I do read as much as I can about horse health issues) What are we suppose to do when we are handed a loaded gun and are dammed if we so and dammed if we do not!! Thank you for posting your site and giving me so much valuable information!! I am going to do some more research into all of the "shots" before they are given next year.
God Bless your efforts!
Cindy W., Grants Pass OR
Tuesday, March 23, 2004
We are a small breeder, with 15 brood mares and 2 stallions. We did not vaccinate any of our horses for WNV. We bred six outside mares to our stallions. Of those, one had a "false pregnancy" according to her vet; she went 11 months, made a bag w/milk, and showed all symptoms of pregnancy, but when sonogramed - no foal. One was in foal, was showing, and then aborted or sluffed the fetus; one looked pregnant but came up open; one had a stillborn foal with a club foot; one never settled; These outside mares were bred to the same stallions that we bred our 11 mares to. We have not had any trouble with our mares or foals. All the foals are up and running within an hour of birth. This seems more than coincidental. Sue U., Clyde, Texas
Tuesday, March 23, 2004
I heard about your site early on last year just after I had given the first dose of the WNV to my Paint stallion and 6 broodmares. 4 of the mares were in foal when the shot was given, and the other 2 did not take that season (This was in May). After reading the stories on the site, I chose not to give them the 6 week booster.
It is now March 22, 2004. On St. Patrick's Day, my 4 yr. old chestnut QH mare Shy delivered a little fawn colored overo stud colt. I was out of town, but arrived within an hour after my neighbor had called me to say that he witnessed the birth and all seemed to have gone well. I was beside myself with joy. I raised my stallion from a baby and this was his firstborn. He was finally here, after 11 long months of waiting.
All appeared normal as I entered the pasture. There was Shy, and the other 5 mares all hovering around this little colt still laying on the ground. I approached, and he tried repeatedly to get up. He kept trying, each time falling flat on his face. He was bleeding from his mouth and nose from hitting the ground so many times. I helped him up to his feet and held him there, hoping he would find his balance after a little encouragement. He fell again. I got him up again. I looked him over as I held him, and then I noticed one of his back legs. The hoof was continually flexed, it couldn't straiten out. I let him back to the ground and looked closer.
The leg had me concerned, but there was something else that made me sick to my stomach. All 4 of his hooves were deformed. Instead of being normal little hooves, where the frog is on the bottom side there were *bushes* of tentacle like growths growing out of the bottom of each hoof. It looked a little bit like hair, but the only way I can really describe it is that it looked like each hoof had a jellyfish inside of it and the tentacles were hanging out. They were 3 to 5 inches long.
That poor baby tried and tried to get up, but he never did. He died at 4 hours old. I reported it to the state vet, but he said that he'd never had a case where anyone suspected the WNV for aborted, stillborn, or deformed foals. Hmmmm...
I still have 3 mares to go, and I don't care what anyone says. I will NEVER use the WNV again. Watching that baby die was like watching my own child die.
I wish us and our horses all luck, and I will keep you updated on how the other 3 ladies do with their babies.
Sincerely, Jamie from Montana
Friday, March 19, 2004
After reading your site i believe that I also have a WNV vac. related case. I am a stallion owner having only 2 of my own mares for breeding. Last year I urged all my clients to get the vaccine. My vet informed me that she didn't like to give it to mares already in-foal so to make sure everyone got it PRIOR to breeding. I had one mare who was in-foal at the time so I didn't get her the shot. The rest were vaccinated march 22-23 of 03. 3 mares came into heat the first week of april so we were breeding them all at the same time. All 3 were checked in foal, and then confirmed later during preg. In Feb. 04 one of the mares appeared to be in labor early. She was in alot of pain and struggled. Then nothing. This was an older mare so we assumed she was just having problems getting foal into position. She then seemed fine and was eating normal the next day. Her due date came and went. She didn't look all that big, but then again she was tiny for her last foal. The vet was scheduled to come out this last week for spring shots again. The old mare was checked-absorbing. Ok fine, that owner gave her horses all the boosters and just thought it was part of the breeding gamble. The next day rounds of the vet found the other mare-different farm-who had been bred at the same time as the old mare was also absorbing! This was a 6 yr. old healthy horse! I am the next stop for the vet's rounds only to be told that yet another mare had a problem. I immediately think something may be wrong with my stud even though he is 13 and has had no prior problems. The last of the 3 mares who were bred together is standing in my barn-very large, no bag, or even a sign that she will foal soon. Movement is felt but no real 'kicks'. More rumbling. We proceed with the rest of the vet visit and give EVERYONE at the show barn their boosters!! (the mare due had received earlier in the month) I go over to the breeding farm where the mare who foaled for me last year was. I feel her and she has a very active KICKING foal and she isn't due until JULY! She did NOT ever get the shot due to being bred, then rebred. Looking back I realize that 3 mares didn't settle the previous year. I also hauled a foal down for a friend to the University to be checked-elbow deformed. Was it just a fluke or looking back could it have been from the WNV vac. the mare got during pregnancy?? I'm am now wondering if my stallion will be able to settle mares, and how long will i have to wait until i can breed my own mares if they don't cycle??
T in Michigan
Saturday, March 13, 2004
I gave all three of my mares the W.N.V shots to include the initial and the booster shot. My Appendix mare was bread in 2003. She had a beautiful Bay Filly 7 March of 2004. 3 days later she started to cycle in (not normal). ON day four she was very alert and healthy, On day five my foal was sick I took her to the vet that afternoon, she was treated and released. He said that she was dehydrated and Hypothermic with a temperature of 95.6, I was to take her home keep her warm and dry, and to start giving her all the medications and electrolytes the following day. She did not make it throughout the night she was dead at 3 in the morning she was only 5 days old. I have never lost a foal until now after the WNV vaccine was given.
Abilene TX resident
Tuesday, March 9, 2004
I am a small breeder of paints, quarters and thoroughbreds. The following is my story and losses due to WNV vaccine. Last year I bred 4 mares. One was a TTBRA maiden mare with no known health problems. She was palpated bred at 30 days. The mare was given the WNV and booster midway through her pregnancy. She foaled full term almost to the day, one palomino and black filly, both born dead, one fully formed and one without eyes, hooves or ear openings. This I thought was just a fluke deal and my own fault for not having a maiden mare ultrasounded to be sure she was only carrying one. However, I still thought a palomino and a black out of a chesnut TTBRA mare was still odd. The second mare was a healthy 7 year old mare, had previously had 4 foals all healthy and normal. The mare was vaccinated 1 month after being bred and again 3 weeks later for her booster. She carried full term and the horse colt was born as normal looking as possible and died 12 hours later from "water belly". The third mare was a 12 year old maiden mare, normal uterine biopsy, bred, confirmed in foal by ultrasound at 30 days. Aborted at 6 months after having received the WNV vaccine. The fourth mare is a 19 year old mare, has had 16 live foals without complications, has had 1 foal suffocate 3 years ago due to the sack not coming completely off when he was born but otherwise normal. She was bred, confirmed in foal by ultrasound, given the WNV and carried full term and delivered a fully formed, gorgeous stud colt that never took a breath. The cord was not twisted, no visible signs of any problems, the mare had an easy labor. Bred the same mare back and again she was given her annual WNV and ultrasounded bred at 30 days and 60 days. At about 6 months I took her in because she didn't look bred to me and sure enough, no baby in there!
Thursday, March 4, 2004
Hello from Washington State. As a breeder standing 3 stallions and
coming into WNV later than most of you. I had already done my research
and decided that we would not give the shots to our herd. We would opt
for the holistic approach and keep water sources as dry as possible and
have treatment alternatives ready should we come up with any cases. I
stand 3 stallions and bred 3 outside mare that we confirmed infoal and
then received WNV shots with in the first 60 days after conception. All
three mare absorbed there foals. I went on to breed 7 more mares who did
not receive any vaccine. Two have foaled and three are due any day.
Sunday, February 29, 2004
I bred eight mares in the 2003 breeding season, all ultrasounded in foal. At
45 days seven of the mares had re-absorbed the fetuses, and when I bred the
seven mares back, I was only able to get one settled, and the vet had to
manually dialate her cervex - something he had never seen before. All of the
mares were vaccinated in April 2003, and both of the stallions as well. Last
week a mare I bought in foal delivered a full term dead foal. The sack had
brown fluid and reeked. Needless to say, I won't be vaccinating with WNV
this year. I am hoping that the damage isn't permanent.
Leslie B -Vermont
Tuesday, February 10, 2004
I am Sandy M. from Colorado on Page 1 of the breeder's reports. My stallion
just died from Acute Liver Failure. They said his liver looked like an
alcoholic's. After feeding the best hay money could buy, weed free and
being kept in a corral, when I'm told he probably ate some toxic weeds....
gee, am I at a loss. I was wondering if anyone else has had anything like
this happen? I don't know if it's related to the vaccine or not. I was
hoping all of my losses from the vaccine were over since I would never
vaccinate for it again.
He was only turning 10 and looked great, no weight loss or bad hair coat.
At first the vet insisted it was colic and that was what he was treated for.
I asked for a blood test convinced it was something else. If not for the
blood work he might have died or been put down with a diagnosis of colic.
Three months earlier I spent a small fortune at the best horse hospital in
Colorado bringing him through a "colic" case. After getting the blood
results I had my vet call this hospital to find out if the liver problem
just appeared or if there were any signs 3 months earlier. Unfortunately
they didn't see a need to run a chemistry breakdown of his blood so now we
will never know if it wasn't actually colic they brought him through at the
time. I guess there is only so many ways a horse can tell you he's hurting,
and even when it's not colic, the visible symptoms can appear the same. I
am really devastated and am hoping one of my two mares in foal to him will
leave me his predecessor to carry on this line I've spent my live and soul
Thanks for being there,
Sandy M. from Colorado
More to come as time allows. Thank you.